Perth Cup

thefalcon · January 2016

I only saw it on tv but the crowd look massive.....imagine counting all the dosh spent on booze and food...be there for a week.

AndrewCarter · January 2016

Andrew Carter said:
Anyone who thinks any jockey is going to worry about the ludicrous whip rules on Saturday is seriously delusional, stewards here have paid zero attention to them and rightfully so, they're a disgrace.
Apart from Bobs horses and one or two others you wouldn't bother feeding the rest of them and
Danny can do whatever he wants on Kirov Boy it's totally impossible as a winning chance is more than 3/4 of the field.

Gee the winner is all class though, the ability to pick up under the 59kg and take very, very narrow gaps after losing crucial momentum, it takes a top class animal to be able to do that and she is just that.

By the way, boy there are some clowns on here who have agendas, now it's oh I'm cruel or inhumane I wouldn't bother feeding them, geniuses who don't appear to possess half a brain, it's a saying.

Anyone who actually knows me, knows that I love horses and wouldn't let them starve, so stop taking everything so bloody literally, anyway poontless arguing or even trying to debate with people like that you would have more hope of a constructive conversation with a brick wall.

Anyway as per usual the results speaks for themselves, how about the distance some of the so called winning chances you guys suggested were beaten by, I was on Neverland very strongly each way as it the each way bet of the year at six bucks but saved on the quinella for a small winning result.

Falcon how did Respondent go by the way, you can't back sadly out of form horses who are lights of other days against in form ones to suddenly turn their form around mate, it just doesn't happen.
I didn't state that to you to be smart or anything, at the time I stated it so you wouldn't waste your money on something that had zero hope.

I had to go and watch the replay after that because I thought I must have missed something the way some of you were talking but it was very, very, plain the other day and raced accordingly again today.

From my post on the lost in never neverland thread on December 27

Sorry guys just watched the replay but Respondent was average again, it
hasn't hit the line once all prep and I can't remember the last time it
ran right through the line.

Backing out of form horses to suddenly regain their old form is a quick trip to the poor house but each to their own.

Barring shocking bad luck or injury to any of the genuine chances it can't possibly win.

Seriously one of these days you lot might just realise that I know what I'm on about when I state something so categorically.

Thoroly_Bread · January 2016

dungy said:

Ridersonthestorm33 said:
Need to see replay again but watching live Pikes ride on Neverland was excellent. To angle to the inside of Bedajimno on straightening almost bought victory. He was keen to race on the speed and maybe steal a head start on Delicacy. It was not that far from coming off. Beaten by a great horse. Only my opinion so it means diddly squat , but some of the criticism and vindictiveness against Pike is staggering. He will have great days he will have some ordinary ones , he will win on favourites , and will lose on them too. I reckon he's great to watch he adds excitement to the game , similar to what Kemp and Harvey did in previous years.
Pretty simple he got it wrong mate spot on with your post some muppets say he wouldn't carry other jocks bags but there simply just phukwits with an axe to grind well done to Hally he stuck in there and got the the low hanging fruit I didn't here the same tosspots patting WP on the back when Perfect Reflection beat the good mare a few weeks ago ??No they were in there caravans drinking the Emu Export were most bottom feeders lay called tall poppy syndrome

How's Willies back this morning did you run him down right last night, make him a nice cup of joe this morning?

darkshines · January 2016

Andrew Carter said:

Andrew Carter said:
Anyone who thinks any jockey is going to worry about the ludicrous whip rules on Saturday is seriously delusional, stewards here have paid zero attention to them and rightfully so, they're a disgrace.
Apart from Bobs horses and one or two others you wouldn't bother feeding the rest of them and
Danny can do whatever he wants on Kirov Boy it's totally impossible as a winning chance is more than 3/4 of the field.

Gee the winner is all class though, the ability to pick up under the 59kg and take very, very narrow gaps after losing crucial momentum, it takes a top class animal to be able to do that and she is just that.

By the way, boy there are some clowns on here who have agendas, now it's oh I'm cruel or inhumane I wouldn't bother feeding them, geniuses who don't appear to possess half a brain, it's a saying.

Anyone who actually knows me, knows that I love horses and wouldn't let them starve, so stop taking everything so bloody literally, anyway poontless arguing or even trying to debate with people like that you would have more hope of a constructive conversation with a brick wall.

Anyway as per usual the results speaks for themselves, how about the distance some of the so called winning chances you guys suggested were beaten by, I was on Neverland very strongly each way as it the each way bet of the year at six bucks but saved on the quinella for a small winning result.

Falcon how did Respondent go by the way, you can't back sadly out of form horses who are lights of other days against in form ones to suddenly turn their form around mate, it just doesn't happen.
I didn't state that to you to be smart or anything, at the time I stated it so you wouldn't waste your money on something that had zero hope.

I had to go and watch the replay after that because I thought I must have missed something the way some of you were talking but it was very, very, plain the other day and raced accordingly again today.

From my post on the lost in never neverland thread on December 27

Sorry guys just watched the replay but Respondent was average again, it
hasn't hit the line once all prep and I can't remember the last time it
ran right through the line.

Backing out of form horses to suddenly regain their old form is a quick trip to the poor house but each to their own.

Barring shocking bad luck or injury to any of the genuine chances it can't possibly win.

Seriously one of these days you lot might just realise that I know what I'm on about when I state something so categorically.

You potted a $15 shot. Bow down before greatness people.

loose_goose · January 2016

dungy said:

ICE said:
Bedamilo for me in a open race
You sure it's not a scratching ???you are the news breaker

You nearly got that right Ice, a Bed and a Milo :)

loose_goose · January 2016

RIO said:
nah, we in Gosnells!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! hate Rockingham as it has taken over our title of Bogan City!!!!

I thought Armadale had that award locked up ever year :-/

youknowit · January 2016

Jesus Andrew you rate yourself very highly in your analysis of horses and form for a nasty sarcastic sometimes part time employed journalist.

SLIPPERGOLDEN · January 2016

SLIPPERGOLDEN said:
I agree Darkhorse but most will struggle to finish strongly at the existing distance let alone stretching them to 3200

I may have been correct with that forecast. :-B

AndrewCarter · January 2016

Youknowit
Yeah mate I do because I'm damn good at it, come to me when your best mate arguably betfairs biggest punter wins a millions bucks on the Melbourne Cup because you correctly marked a horse 14's in your market when it was 50's and tipped it strongly.
Not the first time either that I've correctly given him accurate assessments that were starkly contrary to that of popular opinion that have resulted in big results.

I know how to assess form and video replays correctly.

As for the nasty sarcastic part those who deserve get it, those who are respectful, polite and can carry on a conversation / arguments / debate without resorting to personal abuse, get the same in return.

I've got no time nor tolerance for richard craniums anymore, you try to help people on here and all you get is personal abuse for your trouble and people wonder why I never tip.

Good to see that the same vile individuals on here haven't changed, very few leopards change their spots.

For the record as I stated on several occasion 3/4 of the field was worthless and that the few genuine class horses barring accident or injury would dominate, what a surprise that's exactly what happened.

Laughably there are some on here who think just because those same very, very, average horses have accumulated some stakes money that equates to them having ability, I find that hilarious.

When the quality of horse is so poor apart from the few horses with genuine ability going around that's what happens because something still has to win those Saturday races no matter how mediocre their ability may be, I would have thought that was blindingly obvious even to the most challenged of judges on here, apparently not.

DamienWyer · January 2016

So who is at fault Andrew ? How will this situation you describe get fixed ? How much investment will it take ?

Let's put some positive spin back into the discussion.

AndrewCarter · January 2016

Well whoever dismantled the staying program for starters Damien, having a Perth Cup over 3200m people had some incentive to buy and went out and bought quality horses for the cup.
If there was actually some encouragement for staying programs and for breeders and owners to race and breed stayers like there are in other states the quality of horse would eventually improve.
It's not up to me to fix the problem, personally it doesn't worry me the lack of depth of fields in Perth racing as it makes punting that much easier you just have to be patient and pick your target.

AndrewCarter · January 2016

Where are the Meliador's, the Moss Kingdom's, the Linc the Leopard's, Phizam's, Mirror Magic's etc, etc,etc Damien without Bob's participation the Cup would have been a joke and incredibly some want to knock Pikes, Williams, Peters etc and begudge them their success, they simply go about it far more professionally than most in every virtually every aspect of their approach.

H-BOMBER · January 2016

Ah love these threads

AndrewCarter · January 2016

The winter staying programs at Belmont used to be the highlight of racing at that time of the year but when you systematically set out to dismantle the staying calendar this is the result.

JayJay · January 2016

They are absolutely hilarious, the bait gets thrown out and without fail, its gets taken every time. Psychiatrists would have a field day ...it's like playing hangman.

AndrewCarter · January 2016

DS
I did the same with the cleaner a couple of years ago in the Railway said it couldn't possibly win and hardly surprisingly there was nothing but the sound of crickets afterwards from the same sort of people such as your good self, so it doesn't matter atwhat price I pot them, it's invariably the same result, deafening silence from those who can't admit when they're wrong.

Ridersonthestorm33 · January 2016

Remember when Alan Mathews kept on training those 3200 metre Perth Cup winners...he was almost Cummings like. Amazing effort from him considering the preparation needed and competing against some good stayers from over east too.

AndrewCarter · January 2016

It used to be that I couldn't wait for Perth Cup day and to get out there, now you could barely drag me out there if I didn't have to go for some reason or another.

AndrewCarter · January 2016

Oh yeah it's bait now JJ is it mate, nothing like a blatant attempt to save face now is there, seriously I find it hilarious that a grown man can't admit publicly when he's wrong.

I guarantee if one of those milk drinkers had won the Cup you would have been on here a minute afterwards posting how wrong I was.

I have a lot better things to do with my time than worry about the likes of you stalker boy.

paraletic · January 2016

Give me two minutes please. I need to put the popcorn in the microwave #entertainingthread

youknowit · January 2016

Self acclaimed fg genius our Andrew and a shocking fibber. Your best mate won a million bucks on the melb cup on Betfair? What year was that? And was it your mate Bernard cos if it was i will give him a call and verify it with him. Cant believe anyone can tell such fibs.

DamienWyer · January 2016

The past 12 months have been fabulous for Adam Durrant and Grant Williams, but they have been astronomical for Bob Peters. I thought about three months ago it had reached a tipping point, but now I no longer think it, I know it.

Not begrudging the success of anyone involved for one moment, but it is now strangling the life out of Racing in Perth. Adam and Grant are killing the pig in the Trainers stakes. Nobody else is getting a look in and precious few are doing anything but maintain survival mode.

The knock on effect is about to be felt at the Magic Millions Yearling Sale in four weeks. Very few Trainers will have a database of Owners willing to invest in the 20 or so yearlings on offer, that will over the passage of time, return some of the outlay by winning in town at least once. Buying yearlings that only win in outlying regions is not financially viable. The irony is that Bob Peters is not a buyer in most seasons of stock out of our Premier Sale. He may have to consider Delicacy's full brother but had she been a filly he would have purchased her several months ago direct from the farm.

Breeders as a result, like last year and the year before, will do a post sale analysis that will only lead them to further tighten their breedings and cull rather than expand their herds of broodmares. When they then reach a sustainable level again, then they can think about finding that one or two good mares to rebuild a breeding empire.

By the sheer weight of a hugely successful business career, and a shrewd selection of breeding stock and stallion selection, Bob Peters has forged ahead, so far ahead it seems he is impossible to catch. His broodmare band is now either exclusively black type winners or producers, and they are going to the leading stallions in Australia, several of whom he owns substantial portions of.

But he can be caught in my opinion. What he is doing can be replicated by several owners in this State, but they have to rethink some prior decisions and abandon them in most cases. In this past breeding season, I was dismayed to learn that several make mating decisions based on the service fee of the stallion and the possible deal they can get if they send multiple mares etc. Others buy into under performing entires in the hope that buying cheap will turn into a goldmine. In terms of success, this might as well be throwing darts at the board with stallions named pinned to it, as only luck will play a part.

Yesterday's Perth Cup was a big day out for Bob, but I think the WA Handicapper should really look for a new career. Allowing Delicacy to get into that race with such little weight, then making the field carry 54kg was an enormous error in judgement. She was gifted the race in real terms. She would have won most likely carrying several more kilo's such is her quality, but with the range of weight from top to bottom so condensed, the others had little hope of holding her out. Only very bad luck would have stopped her. Had she been owned by a small time owner or syndicate, I doubt she would have been treated so generously. She is a recent past Horse of the Year for goodness sake.

Well done to Grant and Alana Williams and their staff. You have taken a wonderful opportunity and turned it into a pivotal moment in your respective careers. Long may it continue.

As far as Bob is concerned, I'm really looking forward to seeing the Pierro stock run around in Perth.

This could be a very good five year period in his ownership of racehorses.

SLIPPERGOLDEN · January 2016

Interesting that neither 7 or 9 aired a Perth Cup special live this year.

AndrewCarter · January 2016

Yep it was Viewed and there was story about one of his bets on it on racenet at the time

AndrewCarter · January 2016

I didnt say on Betfair mate what I said was that my mate is arguably the biggest punter on betfair, next time read what has been written I would suggest, he backed viewed in a number of places

AndrewCarter · January 2016

I tipped it to him again in the caulfield cup the following year which it also won, think it was only 25/1 that day though mate. The right people know the truth about my form assessment and that's all that matters.

lame · January 2016

Damien Wyer said:
The past 12 months have been fabulous for Adam Durrant and Grant Williams, but they have been astronomical for Bob Peters. I thought about three months ago it had reached a tipping point, but now I no longer think it, I know it.

Not begrudging the success of anyone involved for one moment, but it is now strangling the life out of Racing in Perth. Adam and Grant are killing the pig in the Trainers stakes. Nobody else is getting a look in and precious few are doing anything but maintain survival mode.

The knock on effect is about to be felt at the Magic Millions Yearling Sale in four weeks. Very few Trainers will have a database of Owners willing to invest in the 20 or so yearlings on offer, that will over the passage of time, return some of the outlay by winning in town at least once. Buying yearlings that only win in outlying regions is not financially viable. The irony is that Bob Peters is not a buyer in most seasons of stock out of our Premier Sale. He may have to consider Delicacy's full brother but had she been a filly he would have purchased her several months ago direct from the farm.

Breeders as a result, like last year and the year before, will do a post sale analysis that will only lead them to further tighten their breedings and cull rather than expand their herds of broodmares. When they then reach a sustainable level again, then they can think about finding that one or two good mares to rebuild a breeding empire.

By the sheer weight of a hugely successful business career, and a shrewd selection of breeding stock and stallion selection, Bob Peters has forged ahead, so far ahead it seems he is impossible to catch. His broodmare band is now either exclusively black type winners or producers, and they are going to the leading stallions in Australia, several of whom he owns substantial portions of.

But he can be caught in my opinion. What he is doing can be replicated by several owners in this State, but they have to rethink some prior decisions and abandon them in most cases. In this past breeding season, I was dismayed to learn that several make mating decisions based on the service fee of the stallion and the possible deal they can get if they send multiple mares etc. Others buy into under performing entires in the hope that buying cheap will turn into a goldmine. In terms of success, this might as well be throwing darts at the board with stallions named pinned to it, as only luck will play a part.

Yesterday's Perth Cup was a big day out for Bob, but I think the WA Handicapper should really look for a new career. Allowing Delicacy to get into that race with such little weight, then making the field carry 54kg was an enormous error in judgement. She was gifted the race in real terms. She would have won most likely carrying several more kilo's such is her quality, but with the range of weight from top to bottom so condensed, the others had little hope of holding her out. Only very bad luck would have stopped her. Had she been owned by a small time owner or syndicate, I doubt she would have been treated so generously. She is a recent past Horse of the Year for goodness sake.

Well done to Grant and Alana Williams and their staff. You have taken a wonderful opportunity and turned it into a pivotal moment in your respective careers. Long may it continue.

As far as Bob is concerned, I'm really looking forward to seeing the Pierro stock run around in Perth.

This could be a very good five year period in his ownership of racehorses.

Will only create opportunities when the 2-3 generation skip occurs and a lot offloaded as being no good , then Bang , the families back ;-)

youknowit · January 2016

Andrew. Lets get on thing very clear. I am not your mate so dont refer to me as such. Secondly i have known you for 25 years and do know you are very careless with the truth. Won a million bucks on Viewed. What absolute ****. You a genius tipster? Moved out of home yet into the Peppy Grove mansion?

lame · January 2016

Also keeping he's band to his 50 that he's set and so many ok-good ones coming through it maybe a possibility he single handedly upgrades the WA stock

Legless · January 2016

Heard that he has 72 yearlings on the ground :-??

G'day Punter!

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