Race fixing accusations - Story in The West

dungy · May 2013

Interesting read front page of the rag this morning nothing will come of it thats for sure our stewards have problems finding there way to the races !!!!!
Racing on the front page AGAIN for all the wrong reasons

http://www.perthturftalk.com.au/news/-informers-race-fixing-accusations--the-west-090513/

Thumper · May 2013

About time this letter raised it's head. Do the non believers still think our racing has been clean for the last 12 months?

Wilson you got any comments to make. Long time since we heard from you?

RIO · May 2013

In the article they say
"We're putting on another investigator. We'll be seeking more pre-race analysis and betting information so we can see what's happening in the betting markets and how the race should unfold according to those betting markets.

They have full access to all that information already...they just don't use it..

and

We've investigated it," he said. "We've put it to the highest people in the industry. We've committed more resources.

It's almost layudible...they get the information early in the year and fully investigated it and no problem. Then they get it again 3 months later and they are looking to get more resources..government direct involvement in the racing industry has to be seem as a thing of the past..the ability of that department to react to situation is too slow and their inability to quell rumors adds to the problem rather than quietens it....

IMO RWWA is outdated and either needs to go, or be totally revamped..Oh and that has been my opinion for several years..They don't suit the dynamic nature of our industry anymore.

http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/sport/a/-/sport/17074696/informers-race-fixing-accusations/

dungy · May 2013

Thumper said:
About time this letter raised it's head. Do the non believers still think our racing has been clean for the last 12 months?

Wilson you got any comments to make. Long time since we heard from you?

But hang on Thumper some punting mad loser could have sent that letter after doing his ass on the punt with baseless facts so how can you take it on face value mate ?
Im not saying its as clean as a whistle in WA but just becasue a letter get sent we shouldnt jump at shadows as i said we dont no who sent the letter of information and how much truth there is to it i bet nothing comes of it

RIO · May 2013

dungy i have rung up the stewards, and left message after message,including the integrity office, and the calls never get returned. I have left e-mail addresses, phone numbers, street addresses...and names and details of incidents i'm concerned about...

You get really frustrated with the lack of service from the stewards and the integrity office.....and recently i posed the question of how confidential is a letter to the stewards???...I am really confident that i read this letter was sent confidentially to the stewards...it is now out and about for all to read. Imagine if this person had put their name to it???

They would be ostracized within the industry forever due to them raising issues that they are aware of...whether they are found to be true or not..and how much damage could it do to innocent registered people in the industry????

The whole integrity of the industry is a joke, when they refuse to talk to people with concerns about incidents in the industry...imagine if the investigation into sexual abuse of female jockeys in NSW a decade ago were not being done confidentially...A lot of change happened as a result of that investigation, and everyone continued working without recriminations.

Confidentiality until proven is paramount to finding the truth

carey · May 2013

the reason dungy, is that some people on here, KNOW too.
i stopped betting wa not because i can't win, but because i perceived stewards were way out of their depth, because often they would ask no questions when it was obvious something was suss, and at the very least, questions HAD to be asked.

i bet nothing comes of it either, but not because it's clean.

Arlo · May 2013

So, Jockeys were named, there has been a full investigation, but no Jockeys were questioned?
Does RWWA seriously think the public can accept their assurances that their has been a full and proper
investigation?

IntoIt · May 2013

ABC 720 going to have an interview this morning with Richard Burt

Chris · May 2013

It's taken a while to surface, I think The West have been itching to run this one.

wedge · May 2013

carey said:

the reason dungy, is that some people on here, KNOW too.
i stopped betting wa not because i can't win, but because i perceived stewards were way out of their depth, because often they would ask no questions when it was obvious something was suss, and at the very least, questions HAD to be asked.

i bet nothing comes of it either, but not because it's clean.

allegedly a significant downturn on TAB wagering on WA T breds since integrity report was released. big punters waved goodbye?

toomuch · May 2013

to the jockeys involved in this corruption an old joke to ponder,,,,,

Question ,, whats 6,3" 130kgs and has ridden an English derby winner?????

Answer ,,, Lester Piggott's cellmate

dungy · May 2013

toomuch said:
to the jockeys involved in this corruption an old joke to ponder,,,,,

Question ,, whats 6,3" 130kgs and has ridden an English derby winner?????

Answer ,,, Lester Piggott's cellmate

=D>

dungy · May 2013

Arlo said:
So, Jockeys were named, there has been a full investigation, but no Jockeys were questioned?
Does RWWA seriously think the public can accept their assurances that their has been a full and proper
investigation?

My thoughts exactly he was just on RR with the boys and when asked if jocks were interviewed he said NO ??
TBH im with me old foe PB our jocks are not smart enough to hook races they would farrk it up week in week out

lick · May 2013

Name names or come up with evidence, otherwise it all sounds like sour grapes.

HenleyBrook · May 2013

hopefully this will set the cat amongst the pigeons. Like most things though, if everyone involved keeps their mouth shut then a positive outcome won't be achieved.

Watch this space as they say.

Buddy23 · May 2013

Haha, i'maughing at all the comments on here re boat races. Same old people saying ive tried talking to the stewards blah blah blah. If you have some solid proof go to the stewards and do something about it. Text or ring wes or shorty on the big breakfast and they will organise a meeting with richard burt, easy. The problem with a lot of people on this site is that they think they know more than they actually do.

carey · May 2013

Buddy23 said:
Haha, i'maughing at all the comments on here re boat races. Same old people saying ive tried talking to the stewards blah blah blah. If you have some solid proof go to the stewards and do something about it. Text or ring wes or shorty on the big breakfast and they will organise a meeting with richard burt, easy. The problem with a lot of people on this site is that they think they know more than they actually do.

Buddy23 · May 2013

Carey, i didn't say I didn't think there were questionable races. I said you need PROOF which every person on this site doesn't have.

velcrocandy · May 2013

Interesting thing here is The West's Racing journalist knew about this weeks ago but didnt think it worthy of reporting on based on the anonymity of the author................not another journo gets hold of it & it hits the front page...................same letter same info....................wtf is up with that ??? Or does the Singo/Waterhouse press coverage get everyone excited ???

Rodent · May 2013

Buddy23, if someone buys just one lotto ticket for the minimum spend and they win 1st division 5 times in a row, is it fair to assume they are cheating? Even if you have no proof?

You're dreaming. I have proof. I have proof that the stewards aren't asking tough questions of riders, when it is patently obvious what has happened in a race, where the horse that gets all the favours (despite such being unlikely based on form) just happens to be the horse backed off the map.

That doesn't mean it's a boat race. It just means stewards are not all over it as they should be. It wouldn't be surprising that nefarious activities might flourish if stewards are seen to be asleep at the wheel.
I think someone above the stewards needs to make them accountable. I have no faith in them.

Buddy23 · May 2013

Rodent sorry to tell you but this is not lotto. And your proof is not proof. Its a very flimsy theory.

TheDiva · May 2013

I think an anonymous letter holds very little weight.

RWWA should request the person's lawyer call them before they investigate any further.

Im also surprised The West made a front page story of an anonymous letter.

Rodent · May 2013

Buddy23 said:
Rodent sorry to tell you but this is not lotto. And your proof is not proof. Its a very flimsy theory.

It is fact that Texan was heavily backed and was allowed to cross from a wide barrier and lead in a pedestrian 37.5 for the first 600m. It is a fact that Times Are Changing is a known front runner who was in form having won at the course and distance at its prior start going out in 36.35 for the first 600m. Against Texan it was inexplicably restrained to midfield and wide and accordingly raced most ungenerously clearly resenting the restraint. It battled on well to run 4th.

Despite Times Are Changing possessing enough speed to race in its preferred position of leading or sitting outside the leader, it was restrained to a most unfavourable position in running.

It is a fact that the heavily backed Texan was clearly advantaged by the bizarre tactics employed on Times Are Changing.

It is a fact that there is no mention of the stewards grilling the rider of Times Are Changing over the clear change of tactics which obviously were to the benefit of Texan and to the detriment of Times Are Changing.

If the stewards didn't see fit to question the rider of Times Are Changing in that race, frankly I have zero faith in them. It is actually hard for me to even think it was just an oversight. I'd feel more comfortable reaching for a nosepeg.

carey · May 2013

if your reasoning was right diva then crooks would have free rein.
whistleblowers have a long proud history of being vilified even when they were right.
you HAVE to be able to do it anonymously.
i have no idea who has done it, but i dip my hat to him.

toomuch · May 2013

The stewards not even talking to the named jockeys is disappointing , shows they are not really interested in
getting to the bottom of it.

By contrast Craig Williams ridding in Japan goes into lock down (cant even contact his family) days before he rides
Not saying we should go this far but the difference in efforts to stamp out corruption is large!

Buddy23 · May 2013

In racing rodent there are many ways in which jockeys can affect the outcome of races without being in the breach of rules. These are the rules in which the sport of horse racing is played. In your example there are too many justafiable reasons for the race being run like it was. Put it down to a bad ride but ive seen many worse.

Fastmoney · May 2013

Buddy23 said:
In racing rodent there are many ways in which jockeys can affect the outcome of races without being in the breach of rules. These are the rules in which the sport of horse racing is played. In your example there are too many justafiable reasons for the race being run like it was. Put it down to a bad ride but ive seen many worse.

With that sort of comment buddy you have all the credentials to become the new investigator or steward.

Rodent · May 2013

Buddy23, you are ignorant. It is the job of the stewards to find out the reasons and then decide if they are justifiable or not. You conveniently ignored the stewards' role completely.
I've seen many bad rides. She could have run the first 600m in 34.0 and that would've been a bad ride too, but it wouldn't have advantaged the heavily backed runner. When it looks bad, it needs to be investigated. Maybe it's just the uncertainty of racing or maybe it's corruption. To determine the difference, one needs to at least ask questions. Keep the bastards honest.

LuckyLongshots · May 2013

The Diva said:
I think an anonymous letter holds very little weight.

RWWA should request the person's lawyer call them before they investigate any further.

Im also surprised The West made a front page story of an anonymous letter.

That may be correct, however if this anonymous source has names, phone numbers and can link those names to particular events - this is massive!

The stewards saying nothing is untoward, just doesn't fly anymore!

Interesting times ahead!

carey · May 2013

and further, if they have named names, given them the races, and explained what was wrong with them, then the name of the person giving the info should be irrelevant.
anybody that understands racing, should be able to view at least some of those races and KNOW.
why it is so bad IMO is that many of these races have had NO questions asked when questions have been sorely needed.
would you be confident going to stewards when so much floats right over their heads or worse?

Buddy23 · May 2013

Stewards look at every race. In this case they would have assessed the horse had an inexperienced jockey on board and veered out sharply on jumping. What do you think the first thought that goes through a riders head is when an unpredictable animal does that? Its to try and stay on the horse and then balance them up. Once that is sorted the jock can then assess the race. In this case she was trapped wide and decided to try and get cover. Your views that jockeys should never get it wrong are incorrect.

G'day Punter!

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